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Robin2
Guest
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 Posted:
Thu Dec 09, 2004 3:01 pm Post subject:
Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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This question was asked here 1½ year ago. At that time there didn't
exist any FTA channels with DVB subtitles, however, there were 3-4
encrypted channels with DVB subtitles.
Does anyone know if anything has happened since then? |
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Anthony Stokes
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Dec 10, 2004 1:50 am Post subject:
Re: Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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I admit to finding the English language subtitling on Welsh 'S4C Digidol'
( FTA via Astra 2A 12129 V SR27500 ) helpful: though not sure whether that
is quite what you mean ?
Anthony. |
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Jomtien
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:47 am Post subject:
Re: Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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Robin2 wrote:
| Quote: | This question was asked here 1½ year ago. At that time there didn't
exist any FTA channels with DVB subtitles, however, there were 3-4
encrypted channels with DVB subtitles.
Does anyone know if anything has happened since then?
|
Yes. The BBC has gone FTA.
--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/6u4p9
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-) |
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HJK
Guest
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| Posted:
Fri Dec 10, 2004 5:59 pm Post subject:
Re: Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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"Jomtien" <jomtien@the.beach> wrote in message
news:c0eir0hp7ppodbb8ebpqk9rd6i2i24ijl9@4ax.com...
| Quote: | Robin2 wrote:
This question was asked here 1½ year ago. At that time there didn't
exist any FTA channels with DVB subtitles, however, there were 3-4
encrypted channels with DVB subtitles.
Does anyone know if anything has happened since then?
Yes. The BBC has gone FTA.
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BBC only use DVB subtitle on BBC Prime which is not FTA. The subtitle
service on BBC is usually
carried in teletext and not as DVB subtitle graphics. |
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Jomtien
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Dec 11, 2004 11:47 am Post subject:
Re: Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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HJK wrote:
| Quote: | This question was asked here 1½ year ago. At that time there didn't
exist any FTA channels with DVB subtitles, however, there were 3-4
encrypted channels with DVB subtitles.
Does anyone know if anything has happened since then?
Yes. The BBC has gone FTA.
BBC only use DVB subtitle on BBC Prime which is not FTA. The subtitle
service on BBC is usually
carried in teletext and not as DVB subtitle graphics.
|
The BBC channels on Astra2 are all chock-a-block with non-teletext
digital subtitles that display on a Sky digibox. I've never bothered
to test them but I suspect that they will display on any DVB receiver.
I'll try them on my Echostar if you like.
--
Digibox problem? : A reboot solves 90% of these.
The Sky Digital FAQ: http://tinyurl.com/6u4p9
How to get UK TV overseas: http://tinyurl.com/6p73
Fed up with logos / red buttons? : http://logofreetv.org/
BBC gone? : http://www.astra2d.co.uk/
----
Only the truth as I see it.
No monies return'd. ;-) |
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HJK
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Dec 11, 2004 3:21 pm Post subject:
Re: Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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"Jomtien" <jomtien@the.beach> skrev i melding
news:cn5lr05asb99ri5du87ohmhl1e01ojjp1q@4ax.com...
| Quote: | HJK wrote:
This question was asked here 1½ year ago. At that time there didn't
exist any FTA channels with DVB subtitles, however, there were 3-4
encrypted channels with DVB subtitles.
Does anyone know if anything has happened since then?
Yes. The BBC has gone FTA.
BBC only use DVB subtitle on BBC Prime which is not FTA. The subtitle
service on BBC is usually
carried in teletext and not as DVB subtitle graphics.
The BBC channels on Astra2 are all chock-a-block with non-teletext
digital subtitles that display on a Sky digibox. I've never bothered
to test them but I suspect that they will display on any DVB receiver.
I'll try them on my Echostar if you like.
|
I have tried it and its teletext subtitles. There is no DVB subtitle
configured
for the BBC. You can also see this on the Digibox as the quality of the
subtitles
has got teletext look.
All BBC services carries teletext but the normal Ceefax service is not on
satellite.
Teletext subtitles transmits ascii characters and the receiver use hardcoded
characterfonts in the receiver memory. With DVB subtitles graphic objects
is transmitted
instead of ascii character numbers.
Hare is some samples from a DVB subtitle analyser I have programmed:
http://home.online.no/~jensts/DVB/DVBSubtitle/DVBSubtitle_Norwegian_Color.jpg
http://home.online.no/~jensts/DVB/DVBSubtitle/DVBSubtitle_Hebrew.jpg
http://home.online.no/~jensts/DVB/DVBSubtitle/DVBSubtitle_Norwegian2.jpg
http://home.online.no/~jensts/DVB/DVBSubtitle/NRK2_DVBsubtitle.jpg
The broadcaster decides which fonts to use and where to locate the objects
within the
720x576 frame. |
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MJ Ray
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Dec 11, 2004 3:49 pm Post subject:
Re: Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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"HJK" <nospam@online.no> wrote:
| Quote: | Teletext subtitles transmits ascii characters and the receiver use hardcoded
characterfonts in the receiver memory. With DVB subtitles graphic objects
is transmitted instead of ascii character numbers.
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So, outside of a few cases where the receiver fonts are the wrong character
set (same problem with cyrillic EPG data for me), "DVB subtitles" use more
data transfer to convey the same information? Why would you want that? |
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HJK
Guest
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| Posted:
Sat Dec 11, 2004 6:34 pm Post subject:
Re: Is there a FTA with DVB subtitles? |
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"MJ Ray" <mjr@dsl.pipex.com> skrev i melding
news:41bad0c3$0$19161$cc9e4d1f@news-text.dial.pipex.com...
| Quote: | "HJK" <nospam@online.no> wrote:
Teletext subtitles transmits ascii characters and the receiver use
hardcoded
characterfonts in the receiver memory. With DVB subtitles graphic
objects
is transmitted instead of ascii character numbers.
So, outside of a few cases where the receiver fonts are the wrong
character
set (same problem with cyrillic EPG data for me), "DVB subtitles" use more
data transfer to convey the same information? Why would you want that?
|
Difficult characters is one of the advantages of DVB Subtitle. Graphics
objects is
transmitted. There wont be a problem with wrong character sets.
Another great advantage is that the DVB subtitle has got the same quality as
proffesional in vision subtitles used by broadcasters. The graphics is run
length encoded to make it
bandwidth efficient.
The graphics can be fittet to 16:9 material which is not the case with
teletext subtitles.
The subtitle will have the same proffesional look in all receivers
supporting DVB subtitles.
A typical display is 10000 bytes. With a new display every
5 seconds the bitrate will be near 16kbit/s-20kbit/s which is not wery
much.
Its the huge difference in quality that makes DVB subtitle a good system.
Even on DVD the subtitles
is poor compared to DVB subtitle.
I guess subtitles is not as big problem in UK as in other countries as all
English/US
speaking movies is subtitled. Some countries tends to dub audio instead of
doing subtitles
and in those countries subtitling is not a big issue.
In many cases the subtitles will be for the hard of hearing. The programs
transmitted
in UK which is not English language will be subtitled in vision with
proffesional subtitle
equipment. For TV channels that needs to or more subtitle language the in
vision method
cant be used. Then its far better to transmit the graphcs from the
proffesional subtitle playout
and decode the graphics in the receiver. |
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